reviving

[DarkBlade]

Im fine with the whole reviving when u die right in the same spot(with the revival sickness) but do any of u think there will be a better way, it just seems to easy to just revive on the spot, maybe get sent back to town. (even though if done numerous times it could get annoying) if in a dungeon get sent back to the beginning of it. any of u agree or have other thoughts? maybe think im absolutly wrong?

[txa1265]

Im fine with the whole reviving when u die right in the same spot(with the revival sickness) but do any of u think there will be a better way, it just seems to easy to just revive on the spot, maybe get sent back to town. (even though if done numerous times it could get annoying) if in a dungeon get sent back to the beginning of it. any of u agree or have other thoughts? maybe think im absolutly wrong?

This has been discussed ad nauseum in a load of different threads.

I think that the general concensus is that single player and multi-player games should have different revive (and save) options.
Single Player:
- Easy gets 'free' revive - revive in place with small loss of gold, but no XP loss
- Normal loses gold, some XP, revive in place
- Difficult loses more gold & XP, dumps you back someplace
- Hardcore gets no revive, in fact, if you die in hardcore HP sends someone to your house to take your pinky ;)

Multiplayer is different, and needs different rules, and I'll let others fill in that discussion.

Mike

[Mythor]

I think reviving in place is fine. Sending players back to Arbitrary Point X is annoying, not really "better" in any way, except that it's more annoying than reviving right where you died. :)
And like Mike said, the penalty at higher levels should be harsher than the easy setting. Easy should be easy and really whipping players doesn't really fit into that.

[onewolf]

if you die in hardcore HP sends someone to your house to take your pinky

...that's awesome.

[Tenka]

Multiplayer is different, and needs different rules, and I'll let others fill in that discussion.



Indeed, from a Multiplayer point of view, the general concensus is "If everyone else can just revive/reload without penalty then why bother trying to do things the hard way". In Multiplayer I think key discouragements come from others not participating in a fair manner, since you are all working together (or against each other in cases of PvP) then having anyone have an advantage just because they dont respect "self-discipline" penalties ruins it for everyone else, therfore more restrictions should be in place.

Anyway, the ideal death penalty for MP IMO:

- Restart at the beggining of a dungeon or be moved back to a "checkpoint" of some sort, might be located half-way through the dungeon, or the last town or moongate you were at.
- Adv penalty only
- Only allow instant revive where yourself or teammates use Revive Spell, (adds to the teamwork of looking out for each other)

In light of the new 'penalty' feedback from CHUK:

- Adding a severe penalty to reviving, such as loss of adv points, adding 'penalty -x' and reviving stunned, may just cover the multiplayer aspect of things. I guess we'll wait and see

[onewolf]

this may be irrelevant, but in multiplayer you aren't going to want to reload saved games anyway, so revive spells/key will be a more pressing issue.

[Narserke]

what if, in multiplayer, you can only be revived either by teamates, or only when your teamates have defeated all monsters within a zone of influence? i have no idea how to handle the whole party dying..probably require to reload from a checkpoint and tenka said.

[Zebulon]

...someone to your house to take your pinky ;)


Mike

I am not that familiar with the english language, so please what is a "pinky"?


Zeb

( I cant agree to your suggestions without knowing this ... otherwise you can count me in :-)

[txa1265]

I am not that familiar with the english language, so please what is a "pinky"?

'pinky' is the smallest finger, the one furthest from the 'thumb'. In many Mafia-related movies, some large, muscular, no-too-bright men are sent to the house of someone who has offended a 'boss', and they are there to show the person they made a mistake, by taking a finger.

Basically it was a joke.

Mike

[araczynski]

according to dictionary.com:

[Probably from Dutch "pinkje", diminutive of "pink" - little finger.]

[houdimoudi]

strg+rmouse
if someone knows what that means :p

[NTJedi]

Single Player:
- Easy gets 'free' revive - revive in place with small loss of gold, but no XP loss
- Normal loses gold, some XP, revive in place
- Difficult loses more gold & XP, dumps you back someplace
- Hardcore gets no revive, in fact, if you die in hardcore HP sends someone to your house to take your pinky ;)

Mike

I disagree with those levels... it should be:

- Easy gets 'free' revive - revive in place with small loss of gold, but no XP loss
- Normal loses gold & XP, dumps you back someplace
- Difficult loses more gold & XP and -1 for one random stat

- Hardcore Death is permanent except for maybe paying some holy shrine TONS of money in advance... upon revival -1 for four random stats, possible loss of one or two items, and some ADV pts lost.


===============

I noticed that CHUK22 wrote this about reviving:

A player who revives w/no ressurect spells loses ADV, suffers penalty, revives stunned. (player can stay down till monsters wander away to prevent repeated death)

First those ressurect spells better be RARE except maybe on easier difficulty levels. Second what does "suffers penalty" mean?? Did anyone get details for this ??
Ideally it should be -1 for one random stat.... otherwise death is nothing but loss of time which means everyone has an IMMORTAL character.

[houdimoudi]

but if there is an penalty such as -1 to random stats i guess everyone will reload after dying. money paying for revive is better, it's tough but i can live with it.
if i get exp or skill penalty, i will reload everytime after dying.

greets houdimoudi

[Aks K]

Hi All

My first post in this forum :). I like the atmosphere here - friendly and intelligent.

Now to the topic:
I agree that the modes of play should be devided into hardore (no revive) and softcore. Maybe softcore also could be further devided, for example into babycore (couldn't help it ;)) with no penalty except little gold loss.

I would suggest for softcore that one should lose 1/2-1/4 the exp gained on that lvl. Like for instance in diablo where you can't loose lvl's only exp. Meaning if you just lvled up you will almost not loose any exp.

Ok, you died ... and you lost lets say 10000 exp and you had 5000 exp that you had not allocated.
Either you could loose the 5000 exp that you had not allocated and subtract random attributes (str, int, ..., honor) for 5000 exp.
Or you could loose 2500 exp that you had not allocated and subtract random attributes for 7500 exp.

Due to the flexible exp system you would still be able to wear armor and weapons - but maybe now with a penalty.

Aks K

[zunno]

This isn't very good. Why mess with the player's character? Just take the ADVPTS he has not spent yet and if there were less of them than the penalty, stop the player's ADVPTS from increasing until he/she earns the remaining amount of the penalty.

For example: you have 5000 points unspent, you die and earn 10000 points of penalty. The 5000 points are deducted from your pool of unspent points, leaving you at 0. Then you have to earn 5000 points by killing monsters to work off the penalty. After those points are earned, your ADVPTS start rising again.

I think this is a better idea.

[Mythor]

I'd have to say taking away XP is probably the less harsh option between taking away XP or ADV points? ADV points are accumulated along with XP, but you don't "spend" XP to go up levels? You do need to spend ADV points to increase your skills though.

Either way is "messing with the player's character" though. ;)

[Aks K]

@Mythor & zunno:

Well you are both right. It is messing up with the player. What I actually ment was that you both reduce advpionts and exp. Dont know about the amount - could be in the range of what I porposed earlier.

Originally Posted by zunno
For example: you have 5000 points unspent, you die and earn 10000 points of penalty. The 5000 points are deducted from your pool of unspent points, leaving you at 0. Then you have to earn 5000 points by killing monsters to work off the penalty. After those points are earned, your ADVPTS start rising again.

@zunno:

Sorry for being unclear. You can never have a penalty in adv points. The first scenario reduced your stored advpt to 0 and then reduced attributes for 5000. For technicallity you would be reduced 1 in int, honor, dex for say 5123, but since you only should get a reduction of 5000 in attributes. 123 advpt would be refered to you stored advpt pole.

The result of that particular death will then be - 1 to int, honor, dex, -10000 exp and a reduction to 123 advpt in the pole of unspent points. For the other scenario you would lose -10000 exp, some attributes and have atleast 2500 advpt in the pole of unspent points. Hope it is clear now ;).

-----------------------------------------

I simplt dont like the penalty of -1 in attributes or random -1 in attributes.

I think being revived comes at a price. For me it is to tame if it only was a gold loss or to defuse if it was -1 (some or all) to attributes.

I would simply like a fair messing up. What is taken in death penalty can be gained again. So it would be a reversible loss.

Aks K

[DarkBlade]

itl be so much easier to just go back to a town or somewhere else. i really dont like the reviving in spot thing. it is kinda stupid. they could do what u guys said with all the loss of exp and adv. points (not as much cause going back to town). it just doesnt make to much sense to come back alive the same place u died :(

[Aks K]

itl be so much easier to just go back to a town or somewhere else. i really dont like the reviving in spot thing.
This would also work for me. I just dont like the -1 to attributes.

Aks K

[txa1265]

Check out info from Chuk that I put in the thread here. (http://dreamcatcherinteractive.com/forums/showpost.php?p=145164&postcount=16)

... and let's just let these two threads join together or something ...

Mike