Racial Differentiation

[PlayerHater]

It seems clear that the characters we are playing with in the demo will be very different in the actual game. The advance point cost differential is the big change in how classes work, and that seems like a great concept. I am looking forward to seeing it in practice.

One thing I have not seen discussed is what difference there will be between different races.

Right now, once you get all your ability scores up to 20, there seems to be no difference between the various races other then the obvious visuals. That means by the time you hit 6th or 7th level, there is no difference between any race you are playing.

To me that takes a lot of the fun out of having different races.

So I would love to see a discussion of what changes people would like to see to make each race unique in more substantive ways then just looks.

Also, if anyone knows of any changes to the racial system that were disclosed by the company before the wipe by all means post them here.

Bob

edit: Perhaps this should have been posted in teh general discussion. Moderator, if that is more appropriate, please move the thread. Thx.

[PlayerHater]

The most obvious thing would be to give each race ability scores that they could purchase at a discount or premium, in much the same way that each class has skills they can purchase at a premium or discount.

For example, if the Urgoth wanted to increase ability scores, the strength and vitality would cost 50% of base for that score, agility and dexterity would cost 100%, and intellect and honor 150% (as an example. numbers of course subject to change).

Certain primary racial skills could also be at a premium or discount, but then this may push the characer development into too many stereotyped characters, which could hurt individuality in the game.

Also, each race could be assigned an automatic bonus, such as the ones you can choose in character creation (eg, Luck, strike +2, athletics +10%, arcane +10%, etc). Again, this may help differentiate the races, but if taken too far could hurt individuality in development.

Let me know if these suggestions are useful, or if anyone has others.

Bob

[Aks K]

I also got puzzeled by this. In the demo the Urgoth character had a difference of ca. 10000 adv points due to different starting attributes than the human character. I did the calculation - couldnt help it ;).

The sceme about discount/penalty in attributes sounds a bit rough to me. Well it all depends on how you want your characters to develop. Consider that instead of a discount you change the index. Meaning that for the urgoth character in the demo, the cost of going from 20 str to 21 str would be the same as going for 10 honor to 11 honor.


Certain primary racial skills could also be at a premium or discount, but then this may push the characer development into too many stereotyped characters, which could hurt individuality in the game.

Also, each race could be assigned an automatic bonus, such as the ones you can choose in character creation (eg, Luck, strike +2, athletics +10%, arcane +10%, etc). Again, this may help differentiate the races, but if taken too far could hurt individuality in development.
Both could work.

Consider that it only depends on the character size. Then one could scrap all of the above. The urgoth is the biggest, so it might get hit more easily. But it has longer arms, so it will have an advantage in close combat. Hope you get my drift.

I dont hope that the bonuses/penalties will be hidden. Btw - Bob, why PlayerHater?

Aks K

[araczynski]

i might've missed this, but i don't remember anything being said about stats being capped at 20 (unless it was just in the demo).

since the real game will include variable skill advancement costs based on class, i don't see why they also couldn't include the same for stats (maybe they are?) as well as per race, for example the dwarf/urgoth would have a 'cheaper' time advancing strength then say the smaller races, which would cost more as you get smaller? same for intelligence/magick/etc...

ummm, i guess that's what playerhater said :) NM :)

but a race bonus and class bonus would be a nice thing as well.

after that, i really don't like spending an hour researching stats and crap as to which class/race i want to play, its a game, i just want to enjoy it, if it becomes a chore from the getgo then forget it.

[Aks K]

i might've missed this, but i don't remember anything being said about stats being capped at 20 (unless it was just in the demo).
Did I say that? I hope not. I saw at least 1 screenshot of the urgoth (click here (http://newspics.rpgdot.com/imageview.php?dir=gallery/762/Screenshots/&name=character_new2.jpg)), where it had starting attributes of 22 in vitality. Check this (http://dreamcatcherinteractive.com/forums/showthread.php?t=20520) thread. To get the bonuses from these class specializations will require attributes above 20.


since the real game will include variable skill advancement costs based on class, i don't see why they also couldn't include the same for stats (maybe they are?) as well as per race, ...
This is not clear for me - what do you mean by this? When you say stats do you mean attributes?


after that, i really don't like spending an hour researching stats and crap as to which class/race i want to play, its a game, i just want to enjoy it, if it becomes a chore from the getgo then forget it.
I dont think you need to spend hours researching. I like this game as a "mind game" as well as playing it. Hope the game will allow both aproaches.

Aks K

[araczynski]

i think i misunderstood your earlier statement about the 20 thing, you're right in that in the alpha 'demo' that any race you choose will act the same if they have the same stats (attributes), but i'm pretty sure that was just the alpha demo thing again, since they said that a lot of 'tuning' type stuff was left out of that 'demo'.

i'm very much hoping that there will be advantages to different races for different classes, other then appearance, like was mentioned above.

somewhat how morrowind did it would be just fine by me i think.